Great take, Tim. The problem in Oregon increasingly is getting renewable resources (especially solar) sited. There are transmission issues, view shed issues, wildlife issues, power purchase agreement issues and labor issues. - Mike McArthur, Community Renewable Energy Association
Hey Tim, can you link to your prices for conversion? All in, cost is approaching >$20k in the builds I've examined which include motor, batteries, controllers, inverters. Issue also: EVs rely on efficiency of all components, like heat pumps. Just running traditional heating and AC would zap the battery fast. Aerodynamics, special tires, network architecture with centralized processing, low center of gravity, redesigned chasis for structural integrity and safety all contribute to why modern EVs work in today's world. Last, demand for EVs is so high that extra batteries and propulsion will be hard to come by at scale even for automakers. Instead, we need a lot of the metals from existing ICE. Dismantling may be the best option.
Mike, I'm working with an auto shop teacher who estimates $10-$12 K for converting my old 1990 Silverado pickup, after removing the optional 4-wheel drive. He has been impressed by the EV motor that Ford has just brought to the market. There is a Facebook group called DYI Electric Vehicles that has members from all over the U.S. who post about their projects. It's also worth checking out EV4U, based in California, for up to date info that you will better understand than I.
On conversions - it's an interesting idea and one we're pursuing for other vehicle types (e.g. electric school buses, transit buses) but for cars I just don't think it scales well, meets warranty and durability expectations, etc., at least until/unless someone develops a cost effective and fairly universal "drop in" conversion kit so it's less custom. Various folks have been exploring that for a while so we may yet see it - especially for international markets.
Good to hear from you. Yes, scale is always an issue, but if we need an "all of the above" response to climate change then many of the initiatives in the "above" will be small, but still important and hard to predict how they may generate other benefits, both on the demand side (the $10K or so available in subsidies could pay for a complete conversion) and the supplement side (more cars available, more people willing to make the transition). As it is now, supply is constrained and take up is slow. And, just as we need a much expanded network of charging stations, we'll need a new generation of electricians and mechanics to service the charging stations and the EVs. I reconnected with a high school automative shop teacher who is going to make a project of converting my old pickup, so I'll be writing about that in the future. And, yes, I'm interested in the tractor for our orchard. I'll send you an email.
Yes, good points, and of course also great to keep the resources and embodied energy in those old vehicles in use. Plus, it probably takes more labor to retrofit = more job creation opportunities. I still think it's probably more promising for old gas vehicles that get dumped in developing countries... but agree we need all of the above (and a bunch of things not even on the list yet!)
Good point, Mike. But, if "all of the above" is the best approach to climate change, then the "above" should include the acreage suitable for solar in rural homesites of 1+ acres. That should be the long hanging fruit for solar.
Great take, Tim. The problem in Oregon increasingly is getting renewable resources (especially solar) sited. There are transmission issues, view shed issues, wildlife issues, power purchase agreement issues and labor issues. - Mike McArthur, Community Renewable Energy Association
Hey Tim, can you link to your prices for conversion? All in, cost is approaching >$20k in the builds I've examined which include motor, batteries, controllers, inverters. Issue also: EVs rely on efficiency of all components, like heat pumps. Just running traditional heating and AC would zap the battery fast. Aerodynamics, special tires, network architecture with centralized processing, low center of gravity, redesigned chasis for structural integrity and safety all contribute to why modern EVs work in today's world. Last, demand for EVs is so high that extra batteries and propulsion will be hard to come by at scale even for automakers. Instead, we need a lot of the metals from existing ICE. Dismantling may be the best option.
Mike, I'm working with an auto shop teacher who estimates $10-$12 K for converting my old 1990 Silverado pickup, after removing the optional 4-wheel drive. He has been impressed by the EV motor that Ford has just brought to the market. There is a Facebook group called DYI Electric Vehicles that has members from all over the U.S. who post about their projects. It's also worth checking out EV4U, based in California, for up to date info that you will better understand than I.
Hey Tim, it's been a while!
On conversions - it's an interesting idea and one we're pursuing for other vehicle types (e.g. electric school buses, transit buses) but for cars I just don't think it scales well, meets warranty and durability expectations, etc., at least until/unless someone develops a cost effective and fairly universal "drop in" conversion kit so it's less custom. Various folks have been exploring that for a while so we may yet see it - especially for international markets.
Also, FYI we have the electric tractor thing moving (see e.g. https://forthmobility.org/news/electric-tractors-come-to-oregon) and will likely have a loaner in your area in the coming year or so if you'd like to be part of testing. Shoot me an email jeffa@forthmobility.org and I can hook you up.
Hi Jeff,
Good to hear from you. Yes, scale is always an issue, but if we need an "all of the above" response to climate change then many of the initiatives in the "above" will be small, but still important and hard to predict how they may generate other benefits, both on the demand side (the $10K or so available in subsidies could pay for a complete conversion) and the supplement side (more cars available, more people willing to make the transition). As it is now, supply is constrained and take up is slow. And, just as we need a much expanded network of charging stations, we'll need a new generation of electricians and mechanics to service the charging stations and the EVs. I reconnected with a high school automative shop teacher who is going to make a project of converting my old pickup, so I'll be writing about that in the future. And, yes, I'm interested in the tractor for our orchard. I'll send you an email.
Yes, good points, and of course also great to keep the resources and embodied energy in those old vehicles in use. Plus, it probably takes more labor to retrofit = more job creation opportunities. I still think it's probably more promising for old gas vehicles that get dumped in developing countries... but agree we need all of the above (and a bunch of things not even on the list yet!)
Good point, Mike. But, if "all of the above" is the best approach to climate change, then the "above" should include the acreage suitable for solar in rural homesites of 1+ acres. That should be the long hanging fruit for solar.